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sojourner

Masonic emblems banned on gravestones

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I post a rather unsavory "diktat" by our politically correct clerics. Maybe we should be more fussy about who we allow to be considered as 'worthy' to become Freemasons as some "ideals" do not live up to our higher standards of morality, integrity, and equality.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/10/09/judge-bans-freemasonry-emblem-from-gravestone-of-senior-mason/

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Banned is incorrect - this decision only effects this request - not all instances - plus there may well be an appeal to the Bishop which overturns the decision



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bod (11/10/2016)
Oh - and he's not a cleric - he is a barrister




"Church of England's Consistory Court

Chancellorof the Diocese of Carlisle in his capacity as a Consistory Court judge, hassaid "No." He said it would be "detrimental" and"inappropriate" to allow it."



I concede it is appertaining in this particular case in this particular instance. But such a "judgement" in the "supreme" appeal body often results in a "stated case" that becomes the guide for future such decisions.

Yes he is a QC, not a Bishop or a Vicar. But acting for and on behalf of the C.O.E. as a 'corporate body'.So are we to believe that this is a 'one off' or one person's opinion' and not representative of "official policy".

I have no intention of discussing 'religion or politics' but do feel it is a matter of concern that may affect us in the future. Hence my long and oft stated reticence about throwing open our doors to all and sundry and trying to be "all fluffy" to the very people we put a 'guard' on the door to keep out.

Perhaps my concern has been emphasised by recent incidences of criminal damage and vandalism at my local Masonic Hall in the last couple of weeks.

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A deeper understanding of the work and operation of the ecclesiastical courts and the difference from the other court systems may be of benefit - they don't work the same way

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Many thanks for that. Most illuminating. My legal experiences date back to 'Probate, Divorce and Admiralty', Torts and criminal law and 'The Wagon Mound', etc., so very outdated. My experience of so called ecclesiastical matters (or interest therein) nil.

I recall some years back a story on a gravestone (not in this country) that had the epitaph, "In loving memory of XXXXX, a loving husband, wonderful father and grandfather but a very poor electrician."

I have sadly attended several funerals of masons (in Scotland) where the deceased's masonic history was detailed, square and compasses applied on the coffin and his apron were displayed on the casket with the floral tributes and various masonic symbols appeared on the gravestone. In one case the whole funeral service was masonic and administered by an obviously 'masonic' minister. So frankly I am at a loss to understand the position in this case, other than institutional prejudice in a so called church that professes to have none.

However, as stated, I have no intention of engaging in a religious or political discussion, merely express my disdain at such pettiness (from any quarter). But thank you for the enlightenment on the reasoning process behind the decision. As the old saying goes, "if you put two lawyers in a room you will get three different opinions."

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Without straying too far into the religious side of things - and not wishing to come across as a critic or slanderer of religion either - It can be observed that the evangelical branch of the CofE, along with their bedfellows in the evangelical wing of other denominations in Christianity, together with their fundamentalist cousins in Islam - have the same complaints about FM
Often adherents don't attempt to ascertain the truth or lie behind their complaints, simply repeat what they have heard

This one Consistory Chancellor appears to be in that mold - it is an individual interpretation of an opinion given some time ago - hopefully someone will have a word with the Bishop and he will intercede so that the contribution of this brother may be recognised in his final resting place

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Regarding the unsavoury views or 'diktats' held by some clerics against the Order I think this would be better challenged by our clerics who are members. The condemnation by these clerics also directly places them against their own religious hierarchy of past and present leading clerics / and or bishops who are in masonic membership.

I think our clerical brethren have an onus to directly challenge the critics as we hold these same members in esteem by honouring them with Provincial and Grand ranks. With honour comes responsibility and this is their knowledge skill set.

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I dont think we can say that this is just one clerics opinion. He is just following the judgement of the General Synod which seems to be official policy of the Church of England.In fact he himself says:

Although,as I have already stated, I make no judgment as to whether Freemasonry is

compatible with Christianity, I cannot help but note that when it last discussed the

subject the General Synod of the Church of England, by a very sizeable majority, by

accepting the last paragraph of the Report Freemasonry and Christianity : Are they

compatible?,decided that there were a number of very fundamental reasons to

question the compatibility of Freemasonry and Christianity.

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Its an opinion - not a judgement - it may appear as though it is splitting hairs, but seeing as we discussing lawyers,k the precise meaning and definition of words is appropriate

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If you read the actual judgement, rather than the newspaper report, you will see that the judge says:

13. The Churchyard Regulations 2010 were issued by me and came into force on 1 October 2010.

From this alone, it would appear to me that the judge was not isolated from the matters on which he was to pass judgement and could easily be biased in his view of the facts.

Of course, the widow, having been saddled with the costs, is unlikely to be able or willing to mount an appeal. I wonder if UGLE will be taking this up in some way?

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Well we all know the church accepts generous donations, I know Liverpool Cathedral '(Anglican) has gad a lift installed paid for by provincial grand lodge, how can there be such inconsistency with regards to this subject

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Slightly of topic but emblem related. On a recent Canadian trip I came across Hedley Cemetery which is in BC eastward of Vancouver and just above the northerly American border.

A cemetery of which a Masonic area is kept separate. The Masonic section has an archway with symbols above. The grave stones had symbols.

The circled part of image which looks like goal posts is the sectioned area from a distance. The white oblong is just hiding a person !


Attached files Tedley Cemetery Masonic.jpg (371.1 KB) 

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Bootlebuck1 (20/10/2016)
how can there be such inconsistency with regards to this subject


Tradition, and even though the judgement contains the Chancellor's individual thoughts on masonry, it is actually the number of emblems that were the core issue not the content

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Lagavara1 (29/10/2016)


Slightly of topic but emblem related. On a recent Canadian trip I came across Hedley Cemetery which is in BC eastward of Vancouver and just above the northerly American border.

A cemetery of which a Masonic area is kept separate. The Masonic section has an archway with symbols above. The grave stones had symbols.

The circled part of image which looks like goal posts is the sectioned area from a distance. The white oblong is just hiding a person !


Cemetries and churchyards are quite distinct and, in England, operate under different authorities and regulations.

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On the Dan Snow BBC programme regards the Klondike Gold Rush circa 1900 there was a shot of a graveyard at a staging post containing some of those who did not make it. He stood alongside a grave clearly marked with a Square, Compasses and the letter G.

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